Episode 8 – Kate – surrogate

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Thanks for watching!

00:14
Surrogacy Australia’s podcast series. I’m your host Anna McKie and my aim is to raise the level of awareness of surrogacy through these conversations. This podcast is a recording from a webinar that I host and you can find more details about those and upcoming dates on our website at surrogacyaustralia.org. The webinars are free, go for an hour and will take you through how surrogacy works in Australia. You can ask questions, typing them in anonymously if you prefer.

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and you hear from a co-host who has navigated surrogacy in Australia, either a surrogate, a gay dad or a straight mum. This episode, recorded in May 2023, features Kate. Kate birthed as a surrogate in Sydney in October 2022 for a couple who were initially strangers and are now lifelong friends. She had a little girl, Vivian, for two dads, Angus and Adam. You may have seen their team featured on Channel 9 show Big Miracles,

01:10
and can hear Adam’s version of this journey in episode 10. In this episode, we talked about how Kate found her IPs, intended parents, and what drew her to them. Only having one embryo as a team, tough pregnancies being different to your own, organizing a surprise baby shower for her IPs and being able to meet their friends and family, direct breastfeeding of Surro Bub and the logistics that go with that in terms of being very close to each other, babysitting post-birth,

01:40
with the surrogate’s children helping out to now having friends, a modern family that she couldn’t be without in life. I hope you enjoy this episode. So Kate, there’s a lot of people happening in this photo. Tell us, tell us who’s there. Okay, so I’m happily married for quite a long time with my lovely husband who’s in the maroon shirt. I just don’t know what color it was. And then…

02:02
All the kids in between and to the left of me are all mine. I have five of my own ranging from 18 to 13. So yes, five in five years, yes, I’m nuts. And yes, I did do more. So if you haven’t got any or you’ve got loads, doesn’t matter, I’m sorry, this is for anyone. And then we have Adam in the middle and Angus in the blue shirt. And then to the left of Angus is Corinne, who is the egg donor and her partner.

02:32
What a village here, hey? Totally. We’ll go back to the beginning of your journey a little bit later on and how this whole team came to be, but we’ll keep moving through these photos here. So I saw this photo on TV, but tell us what was happening in this photo. So I felt really guilty this day actually, because I planned with the film crew to have this event because it was Gus’s birthday the next day. And we said, they said, have you got something coming up? Let’s have a catch up. And I went, perfect. It was two days after.

03:02
my periods were due and I wasn’t gonna test until, because we’re having the blood test on the Tuesday. I’d been peeing on the stick, which everyone does or doesn’t do. Secretly I did and I knew I was pregnant, so I surprised them. So instead of singing, we’re singing Happy Birthday and I presented him with a Happy Birthday cake that said I’m pregnant. Well, didn’t the tears flow? But it was great, it made great TV and they were so happy.

03:29
And so was I, but I felt very guilty because I pretended to have an alcoholic drink, which I didn’t drink, but they showed on TV. I was like, oh my God, that made me look so bad. I felt so guilty, but it was worth it. It was worth every bit. Absolutely. And the big smiles on all of your faces there. Can’t fake that. No, no. What a fun moment. So work first embryo transfer for your team? Yeah, yep. And they only had one embryo. While I had done my transfer, was doing a second round to.

03:58
to get more MRes because we, you know, I was 12 years since my last birth and I didn’t know whether my body was gonna know what to do, I was 42 and you know, it’d been a while so. But it did, hey? It did, it worked, yeah. So then you’re pregnant and then you’ve got some announcements here? Yes, yep, so I’ve got some shirts made and my husband was like, I need to deliver a note, it’s not mine, like, because he’s a teacher. He was like.

04:24
gonna think she’s pregnant again are they freaking crazy they’ve got five do they not know what causes it so yeah we’re very proud to uh you know wear the shirts and i still wear mine oh yeah great did your husband wear your husband wear it much no no he didn’t wear it he’s a PE teacher he he was happy to wear his uniform um my husband and i both teachers at the same school so i got to do

04:54
sharing the good news. Yes, I’m pregnant and it’s not Glenn’s. Yeah. And it’s not mine. People look at you like, hang on. And especially when it’s two dads, they’re like, so hang on, who’s sperm and well, it can’t be either of the, like one doesn’t have eggs. Yes, that’s right. Did you have any particular moments when you were announcing to people, there’s some fun awkwardness that you got to play on that a bit more? It was, it’s people just look at you like,

05:24
So hang on, you’re carrying for someone else. I’m like, yes. I’m like, are you crazy? I’m like, I am crazy, of course. Yes. So yeah, it looks like there was lots of humor in your team and lots of positivity. Yes, yep. And so lots of catch-ups too that happened outside of appointments. Photo here of you guys having dinner together, just the adults. Yep, so I was heavily pregnant in that one on the left. We went to Doyle’s for lunch. It was our sort of,

05:54
We were due to go away and I got quite sick. I got COVID, I had, you know, HG. I had, you know, all the fun stuff. And instead of going away, we decided, we booked a hotel and the boys booked a hotel in the city. We stayed there the night and then we went and had lunch and then some non-alcoholic cocktails prior to, it was our baby moon. And yeah, and then the one on the, the photo on the other side is how I offered to be their surrogate.

06:24
Right. Yes. I was wondering what the little baby symbolized there. Yeah. So it’s a record. You can record a message on it. And I recorded a message just saying I’d like to be a surrogate. So yeah. Wonderful. Oh, what a fun way to do it. I’m just going to ask you something there. So some listeners here might not know what HG is. Can you expand on that for us? It’s really bad morning sickness, basically. Your body decides that it’s in my…

06:51
circumstance, it had a foreign object and it didn’t like it. So my body reacted by having all day nausea and vomiting right up until 24 weeks. And with none of my other, I had morning sickness, but that was to about maybe nine, 10 weeks with my other kids. Some not at all, just felt a bit queasy. But this, I lost eight kilos. I think by the time I finished, I’d only put on three kilos during the whole pregnancy. So, and that was just

07:19
Viv, really. So I was happy at the end of it, but yeah, it was tough. Yeah. And often surrogates go into surrogacy because they had fairly smooth pregnancies, but you just never know what it’s gonna be like, do you? You have to expect the unexpected because things like veins pop up and COVID and all those kinds of things, so yeah. And you’re always older each time you have a pregnancy, so it’s a bit harder on your body. Yes, the wrinkles and the gray hairs.

07:49
But we managed a baby shower, it was amazing, it was awesome. Their family and friends joined us and it was so nice to see the community that they’d had around them prior to Viv being born and then that community still being around, you know, in a different shape or form. And watching the team to be involved in things like the baby shower, I mean these are things that surrogates and IPs may or may not think about, that oh yes, the parents don’t have a baby in their tummy.

08:17
they had to bring the surrogate along to the baby shower. So yeah. And the boys didn’t want a baby shower. And I said, you have to have a baby shower. So I organized it for them. So it was a bit of a surprise because I didn’t know how it was all gonna work. And yeah, it was great. We played games and guessing comps and all the normal things that you have in a baby shower. So it was lovely. The people listening there, if you’re hearing what Kate’s saying, so these guys were initially strangers. She organized that with the friends and family. So clearly you got to know the friends and family well. It’s so important, yeah.

08:46
so that you were communicating with their friends and family to put this event on? Yeah, I hadn’t met any of them. I’d only met the Gus’s mum and obviously Corinne, but the rest I actually met at the baby shower. That was the first time we’d met and I was seven months pregnant. Right, well I’m glad you got the chance to meet them then to see who you were. It was nice and that’s you know how you realize that it does take communities

09:16
And then we lead up to birth. And so talk us through the birth, was it an induction? It was an induction, yep. Based on my age and being a geriatric. We don’t, I don’t feel like a geriatric, but in maternal terms, I’m geriatric. At birth, how old were you then? 42. 42, yep. And so did the…

09:40
the labour go similar to your other pregnancies? It was all my inductions had been very quick. My last birth was 12 minutes from the time that they put the drip in. Yeah, so that’s why we made sure that we were in the hospital because we had the film crew because we had two dads. It really needed to be a bit more planned and it did take a bit longer. I was induced at nine o’clock and I ended up giving birth at 3.30 in the afternoon, but hey that’s not that long really. Yes.

10:07
But one big push, I was not expecting to have a water birth either. So they’d asked me beforehand, a couple of weeks beforehand, the film crew, are you planning on water birth? We’ll make sure that we’ve got the right room. I’m like, no, no, not my thing. Anyway, there you see it. Yes. It was awesome. Was that your only water birth? Yes. Yeah, that was amazing. I highly recommend it, actually. It was very, very relaxing. Oh, me too. I’ve had to. And yeah, I found it empowering. And the water was, you know, great reliever.

10:35
Yeah, and so then people around you, giving birth to Miss Vivian, and then so after the pool, you came back to the bed? Yes, they help you out of the bath, and then you jump back on the bed, and we did, I had baby contact for a while, I breastfed straight away, and then just that time to recover and let my body realize what it had done. And then one of the dads cut the cord, and then we did…

11:03
Pass a parcel. And they then had their skin to skin contact while I managed to go and have a shower and do all the fun stuff. Beautiful. Yeah. And so then other common questions people often ask is, so how did that work in hospital? Did you stay a night and did you have rooms next to each other or something? So I lucked it up. I actually, I gave birth on the Friday and didn’t leave till Tuesday morning.

11:30
The dads stayed, they lived five minutes away, but the hospital said that they had rooms, so they accommodated them in the room next door. So I could breastfeed some of the feeds, and then I would express so that they could do one of the night feeds so I could get some sleep. And then, yeah, we’d just rotate and work out what was best. And I only lived sort of five minutes down the road normally. So we continued that after the hospital as well. So it was…

11:57
It was very flexible. Whatever worked for them and Viv and whatever worked for me. Wonderful. Sounds like there’s lots of communication going on there as a team. Has to, yeah. And here’s a photo of all the adults. May is- May would love. And my big bazookas. They are big when they’re full of milk, eh? Oh my goodness, yeah. And how long did you express milk for? Also, I did, I breastfed for six, eight weeks.

12:27
and expressed as well. So we started off with four or five feeds a day, breastfeeding, and then they would do the other two express. And then we wind it down. Then I got mastitis. So we try to wind it down too quickly. So you learn from your mistakes. But that’s when I just decided to stop. So then I donated the rest of my milk to the milk bank. And on that, in terms of the logistics then of doing direct breastfeeds, meant either they were at your house or you were at their house.

12:56
a large portion of the time then. Yeah, it was great because that way I, my body was still real, I think it’s a bit of a shock to the system that, you know, one minute you have a baby and the next minute you don’t and that’s not in your home like your normal. I think for me, psychologically and emotionally, my uterus contract to help my body, you know, do what it was supposed to do. And mentally I was like, I know the baby is just up the road and it’s not mine, but my body’s still doing what it needs to do after birth. So.

13:25
Everyone’s different, but it worked for us. The dads came to me a couple of times a day or I’d go to them and eventually we got down to one visitor day either way. And then it became, you know, once every few days. So I’d turn up with my milk, bags of milk. You’d been expressing in between. Yeah, yeah. That’s wonderful. What a fantastic start to life Miss Vivian’s had there with your milk. And as you say, to help your body in its recovery as well too.

13:54
I’m going to come back and unpack that as well, a bit more about that psychological feeling there. Just finishing up with some of our photos here, the dads with a little hospital blanket too. Yeah. Gorgeous photos. And then I think just some catch ups here. Post births, a couple of significant events I reckon happening here. Totally. So the one on the right is, or for my right, is opening night of big miracles.

14:19
So it was quite weird because I turned up with a baby and they turned up with a baby because we’re foster carers as well. So that people were like, hang on, how did you just have another baby? That was, it was, it was nice to spend that time with Viv and then obviously they’ve just, we’ve just become godparents to Viv as well. Wonderful. So that was a baptism christening there. Correct. Baptism.

14:44
Yeah and so that’s a great example again people who are brand new listening going these people were strangers and now they’re godparents to the child. I don’t know what we do without them in our lives to be honest. Yeah so they’ve become not just a part of your life in terms of the adults but are you saying that they’ve become a significant part of your your own kid’s life too? Yeah my kids love having them around while we went to dinner last night to celebrate the parentage order. My daughter baby sat Viv while we went out and

15:12
a few drinks and dinner. It was, yeah, it’s a very special relationship and it’s a nice extension. They’re our family and they classify us as their family too. Wow. And again, for those listening, so there’s a lot of trust involved there that they, that your daughter babysat their child, that, you know, often as new parents, you’re a bit nervous about other people doing it right by your baby routines and whatever, but clearly…

15:37
your family knows her routines and how to put her to bed and feed her and all of that, that they feel comfortable and trust. Yeah, the trust has to work both ways in surrogacy. Absolutely. Very important. Yeah, let’s backtrack a little. Just talk more, Kate, about the post-birth there. Could you feel any, like your body, your head, heart and hormones feeling differently? Like was your body, did it feel at ease once it had some cuddles with Vivian?

16:05
anything that you can comment on there? It’s funny because the whole pregnancy, it was in my brain, I had an alien. She was my little alien. And when she was moving, I was like, oh, the little alien’s moving. So when she came out, I was like, oh, thank God the alien’s out. Yes. Because you try to separate the, it’s a bit like we have foster children, they’re not our children. So I can quite happily hand them back to wherever they’re going or to the next place.

16:35
The same was, that’s how I trained my brain to say, Vivian’s not ours or mine. So I think that made it a lot easier for my brain to cope with the fact that I just had a baby and that it wasn’t staying. So you were mentally ready and again, wow, as you’ve been an egg donor before and a foster care family here, amazing that the things that you’ve done. But when we say amazing, you just probably take it in your stride. It’s just, this is what we do.

17:02
So were you used to the idea of that, you know, mentally handing them back, but did you notice anything different then you were saying with Vivian this time round, as opposed to- It’s funny you feel that nurturing role that you, you know, the aunt, the huge aunt role, and a really important aunt role, because you’ve just baked this baby for nine months and it’s a part of you, and she’s sucked everything out of you to grow and be who she is. And now I’ve handed her over and I feel like-

17:32
relief because my job has been successful and I’ve done that job and now it’s their job the next forever years. So yeah, I think psychologically that’s why my brain went, yep, I’ve done my job, I know what I’ve done and I’m quite happy and content with that. Wonderful. Yes, and you can have cuddles and hand them back. Exactly right. I don’t have to deal with the nighttime screams. Pooey nappies. Exactly. And so then going back further to the beginning then.

18:00
So you found these boys at some point in time. What led you to wanting to be a surrogate in the first place and how did you find them? It’s funny because I’d offered to one of the ladies that I’d offered to be an egg donor for and she ended up falling pregnant through IVF with twins. I was like, okay, well, you don’t need me anymore. So I then went on to donate another time with my eggs. And then I still had this yearning that, I’d still love to have another baby. And then it was like, mm-mm, not.

18:29
Not with me, we’re not, no, buys enough. We shut that shop. And I was like, oh, I’d still really like to be a star. He goes, oh, whatever makes you happy, sweetheart. So I got back on the ASC Facebook page and started seeing who was around. And I was like, ooh, I like that. I like that comment. And so I did a bit of Facebook stalking like we all do.

18:59
Or maybe we don’t, but I do. And I sent Angus a message saying, look, I know this is a bit weird, but are you still looking for a surrogate and where are you at? And I’m thinking about being a surrogate and we got chatting. And I think that was like the middle of August and by this, I think I offered to be the surrogate on the 12th of October. So ours was quite short, but I spent so long.

19:24
already in the community that I knew what I was looking for and what my expectations were. And between the four of us, Daniel and the two lads, that we nutted out the nitty gritty of everything. And it was not a question that we hadn’t asked each other. We’d gone through, you know, Sarah Jeffords and your webinars and all the information that was out there and what was, there was no question that wasn’t answered. And…

19:52
If they didn’t answer it and they couldn’t answer it, then we’d talk it through to get to that response. And I just knew in my gut, it was the right scenario and the results, and it doesn’t always work out like that for some surrogates or IPs, but the importance is making sure that you are open and you have that line of communication, that you can talk about the good things and the bad things and the ugly things.

20:20
And because yeah, you just, you don’t know where it’s going to go. And not every journey is simple. There’s always, there could be complications in it. So yeah, it’s important to make sure that you’ve got that lines of communication open and the trust. Very true. Yes. Cause you’ll need it at some point. Totally. To answer the question that Jamie’s typed in there, how did you go about picking your IPs then? So when you were looking through these posts, was there something were you looking for two guys or a straight couple or were you, is there something?

20:49
No, it’s funny, I thought I was going to go for a heterosexual couple. Then when I saw one of Angus’s comments in the ASC community, I was like, you just got feeling just seemed right. And then when I saw it, they’d done a post to their family and friends on their own Facebook page about their journey and being so open and honest.

21:19
Then I looked underneath in the comments from their family and friends and the support that they had. I was like, this feels right. And it was funny, they live five minutes up the road. They’ve got Labradors like we do. They’ve got chickens like we do. They were just like the gay version of Daniel and I without kids. And it was a match made in heaven. It was, you do, you just know. And I think if you have to work really hard in a relationship, it’s like a friendship.

21:48
Like a normal friend, if you’re trying to be a surrogate or an IP, I think if you have to work too hard, something usually isn’t right, I think. I like that. That’s a gold line there, Kate. And you’re right. If you have to work too hard, it’s got to be organic because you’ve got to enjoy their company in the hard times. So it needs to be easy in the easy times. Yeah.

22:13
Well said there. Were there any particular challenges then that did arise for your team when you’re saying you needed open communication, whatever? Were there any times that you were glad they had that good friendship? Yeah, I think knowing that they only had the one embryo was really, really tough for me personally, because that puts a lot of pressure on the surrogate. And although I knew what they were going through too, because you don’t wanna let them down. You’ve gone through all these lawyers

22:43
IVF expenses and the expenses I had to get to that point too, we don’t want to let them down and you don’t want your body to fail them in a way. So my heart was saying, don’t break their hearts by failing. But obviously in our scenario it worked, but I think that’s a real challenge that if you’re not open and honest and telling them those things as well, telling them that you fear of failure.

23:14
It’s really important for them to know how you’re feeling. Don’t just bottle it up and not say anything. If you’re struggling with, you know, I was on my feet 24 hours a day at work, not 24 hours, but I was on them 12 hours a day, it was a lot. One of the dads, Adam, came in and helped me at the shop and served customers and cooked fries. And you know, you just, you really need to open those lines of communication. It’s so important to ask and be willing to ask for help

23:44
for someone like myself who’s so independent and likes to do things their way and get things done, give a busy person something to do and they’ll get it done faster than anyone that’s, you know. It was really important for me to break down those barriers and say, I need help. Yes, because you’re an independent woman and now suddenly have to ask other adults to help you. But it’s a way of involving them in the pregnancy too. Totally, yeah. And they’ll have memories of helping you out at the shop too, aren’t they?

24:14
Good stuff. One of the questions that somebody’s typed in here is that what would happen if the hospital wouldn’t accommodate IPs to stay the night after birth? Does the baby stay at the hospital? What’s your insight from your time in the community there? Yeah, every hospital is so different and you really need to be an advocate for your surrogate and your team. I’ve got a friend who at the moment is at a different hospital. They haven’t had a surrogacy journey there before. So…

24:41
I was able to give them some inside knowledge of what we had at our hospital, both private hospitals, mind you. So being able to, even if it’s just one of the IPs and how that looks, having your husband there or your partner as your primary, which most people want. I know Beth, one of the IPs, and then it’s just everyone’s individual, but being an advocate for your surrogate and your team is really, really important in…

25:11
finding out what the hospitals allow. Yeah. I would say in my experience, it’s very rare that it doesn’t happen. The IPs are usually staying in the hospital as well, but the advocates, so it’s even maybe before you’re pregnant, find out which hospital you’d like to birth in, ask them if they’ve got a surrogacy policy. And then certainly when you’re early pregnant, start the conversations, because you might have to educate the hospital about how surrogacy works if it’s the first one. So I think most people,

25:40
you know, it’s a very joyful thing to be around for midwives and doctors and they’ll accommodate as best they can, but it still might be new to them. And particularly during peak COVID times, there was some challenges there because of people there. But hopefully as things ease off, they’re moving into the future and more surrogacy getting done year by year, that hopefully things will improve there. So I think it’s much more common for the IPs to be in the hospital. Yes. Yeah. So I’d agree with that one too.

26:07
And in terms of time, Kate, you mentioned like an August, October of a particular year. So once you, you know, officially offered and then you did the paperwork, like the counseling and the legals and stuff. Do you remember how many months that took you to get through all of those appointments? So I met them in the August, I offered in the October. I did have a little stipulation that I really didn’t want to be pregnant or due to have a baby in over the summertime. So we had little time constraints.

26:34
The gents had already started egg in the October. They started that, so there was quarantine. So once they had their embryo created, they had the testing and that was done. So I was up the duff or had my transfer in February. So it was- And she was born in October of 2022. Like a year and a bit over first chat. Yes. Yes, fast. It was fast, but it was the right fast for us.

27:03
Every team is different and I say that in saying, because and everyone I talk to about, sorry to say, I reiterate the importance of it being a marathon. Everyone’s marathon is different. I do marathons quickly. But most people take their time and it’s really important to make sure that you have the nitty gritty of everything. And I think for brand new people listening to this, I’ll point out,

27:32
Kate wasn’t brand new herself to the world of autism. So she’d already been an egg donor many times, which means that she had already built up connections with strangers multiple times, fast tracking a friendship to get to know them and what that would be like. And therefore already had experience because some of those donor babies had already been born in terms of what does a friendship look like in the future with people that you weren’t friends with before? Because you sort of, you were more experienced in this world coming in, I would say.

28:02
So I started my egg donations in 2018. And then I offered to be a surrogate in 2019. And then obviously did more research and worked out what I wanted and what would be best for our family and that sort of narrowed it down, I suppose. So yeah, I think, yeah, in your head, you were already in that marathon in some ways. Yes, yeah. You were a full time. Yeah.

28:28
Anonymous has asked you then perhaps how long do you recommend? I’m not sure if they’re directing that at Anna or Kate, but to surrogate should know their IPs before starting. I’ll add in like a rough guide. If you imagine the journey overall might be about two years. So obviously the pregnancy is nine months, but it might not work first go. So it could take you a year to get pregnant. And then if you sort of have a year in your head, we sort of would recommend if you want a recipe, six months of surrogate dating. So

28:56
Technically I offered to Matt and Brendan on the second time I met them, but what I offered was I said, I want to be your surrogate. I want to be exclusive so that you’re not dating anyone else and neither am I. And then in about six months time, I’ll officially offer. And at that point in time, we’ll move forward with the counseling and legals. And that’s what we did. And they asked us that time to do our paperwork. And then that’s because they could only start creating their embryos with their egg donor from that point. And then the quarantine for the embryos. So for us, it was a year.

29:24
from when we first started chatting to when we had our first transfer which didn’t work anyway. So yeah I think a six month but again it’s as Kate’s saying too it does go on your gut instinct too if you feel comfortable but also try and make sure you’ve done things in that time like maybe met some of each other’s friends and family or particularly the IPs and the surrogates kids and all of that sort of stuff there. Yeah I think it’s really important to be wise and open to what’s around you.

29:53
And people get this idea of, I’m gonna be a surrogate. This is what I’m gonna do, but there’s so much more to it in learning and looking at the resources around you and learning from other surrogates too. And I think that’s also why the surrogacy support group has the three months thing before you join their community because they want you to understand how the actual surrogacy community works before you join the support group. Yes.

30:23
Yeah, so what Kate’s mentioning there is there is also a surrogate-only Facebook group, which is about, I don’t know, 150 to 200 women in that across Australia. And so that’s often where surrogates find their support with their surro sisters. So yes, I think what you’re saying there is it is important to have friends to talk about this journey with, not just in your own team. An anonymous question here says, a single gay male, should I have the embryo first, then find a surrogate or find a surrogate first, as Kate’s timeline seemed to work? Any advice on that one, Kate?

30:53
I thought by Lord that you had to have a surrogate before an embryo was created. I know different states. And so that’s tricky. Yeah. So some of the hetero couples who’ve already been thriving have made their embryos. Yes. We had Dr. Shardi on as a, your Dr. Shardi. Yes. A couple of weeks ago and he was saying they, yes, they’re allowing the creation of that.

31:15
at the moment. So, but it might depend on the clinic. So, yes, that’s something over time that’s going to change. I think it’s very important that they in some ways that they are created beforehand, because it makes the journey a lot more simplified. Because, you know, like me, I was, I’m only getting older and it pregnancy as you’re older does tend to be a bit harder. So having those embryos created and it also gives us

31:43
that you’re committed to this process and that you’re willing, that you’ve already made that commitment to having the process of surrogacy. I’d absolutely agree. I think I hear anecdotally that surrogates would prefer that the embryos are made, but then they know sort of what they’re dealing with or only got one, you know, are you prepared to move to donor eggs after that, they’re a hetero couple? And for those that are listening and for your team, was there a backup plan? Yeah, so that’s when,

32:13
Adam’s sister had to do the second round because they only had the one embryo. So I did the transfer and the day that I did my transfer, she went in for her egg collection. What a day. Yeah. So were they able to make some more embryos? So they’ve got two more. Yeah. So sibling 2.0 won’t be me because I’ve retired from surrogacy. One and done. So yes, so they will be looking for another one if anyone’s looking. A little plug for them there. Pimp out your plug. They’re great Ps or IPs.

32:42
Well, you’d have to share them then, eh? I’m happy to. They’re just awesome blokes. Yeah. And it makes that community bigger too. That’s true. Would it feel weird at all having another surrogate be with you? No, no. I just, you know, we’re all pretty cool and crazy, but yeah, I think I’d love to see them, Viv have a little brother or sister and you know, someone else to share the joys that I’ve had, you know? Wonderful. Yes. Well, that’s lovely. Little plug for them there.

33:12
So as we sort of come towards the end of tonight here, so think about any parting advice, Kate, you’ve got for people, or are there any extra challenges or hard times that are worth mentioning for people to learn on? I think the hard times are making sure that you have sorted out or not discuss the hard things. If you get pregnant and there’s an issue, are you willing to terminate? Are the IPs willing to terminate? They’re things that people don’t tend to talk about or don’t like to talk about, and they’re really, really important.

33:42
What happens if you get really ill and you’re on bed rest from six months or seven months? Who is gonna help you around the house? Who is going to, how are they gonna financially be able to support you and you’re not working? They’re the really big ones that, I mean, we got to the point that, my legs were pulsating and I had to, and that’s why they came in to help me at work. So, the physical challenges were for me, the hardest being a bit older.

34:12
and your body not coping as well as it did, you know, 12 years ago. All in all, I think just take your time and follow your gut. If something’s not right, you really need to open up and talk about it and find out what that why you’ve got that feeling that something’s not right. And enjoy the ride. Hmm. Great advice. I think for my team there, yes, we would sometimes put the hard conversations on the table and then sometimes we might say, let’s come back to this in a week.

34:39
but then we knew we’d come back and that was the thing that needed to be talked about. And you just have to get through it, don’t you? Totally. One hell of a ride. It’s fun. It’s ups and downs, but at the end of the day, to be able to hand over a little baby to someone who would otherwise not be able to have a baby. Yeah, it’s amazing. And definitely one off the bucket list, that’s for sure. Absolutely. Not one on everyone’s bucket list, but it was definitely one to do and to be able to.

35:07
be an advocate through big miracles and our story on, you know, it’s funny, my son is doing legal studies and his teacher showed big miracles in their lesson. So you’ve got 25 boys, U12 students learning about gay marriage and surrogacy. And I think, you know, the world has opened up its doors to so many different things. And if one person like myself can be an advocate and support, I think the world can be a better

35:36
I totally agree. And me being a teacher, I was pregnant in a school. And so every kid there who saw me pregnant learnt a story. And so I think, yeah, that’s how we get the word out there. And that next generation, like your own kids there, that they’ve seen their mum be a surrogate and their friends know you would have done it too. So, you’re all pretty proud of you. Thanks. Thank you for sharing your time with me for this episode. If you’re finding these episodes helpful, please share them with friends.

36:04
If you’d like to see the images mentioned, head to our YouTube channel for all of the recordings. If you’re looking for more individualised support, consider joining SASS, Surrogacy Australia’s support service, so you can be connected with a mentor and also with me to help guide you on a journey. You might think of me as your Siri for surrogacy. Until next time, welcome to the village.