Episode 156 – Jess – surrogate

00:14
Welcome to Surrogacy Australia’s podcast series. I’m your host Anna McKie and my aim is to raise the level of awareness of surrogacy through these conversations. This podcast is a recording from a webinar that I host and you can find more details about those and upcoming dates on our website at surrogacyaustralia.org. The webinars are free, go for an hour and we’ll take you through how surrogacy works in Australia. You can ask questions, typing them in anonymously if you prefer.

00:42
and you hear from a co-host who has navigated surrogacy in Australia, either a surrogate, a gay dad, or a straight mum. This episode featuring surrogate Jess was recorded in June 2026. Jess and husband Scott live in South West Sydney with their two daughters, and she has birthed two girls as a surrogate, Firth in April 2022 and Logan in September 2025. The two dads, Ryan and Adam, who live in the Blue Mountains,

01:11
used eggs from Ryan’s sister Rhiannon. It is through Rhiannon that this connection was made as she and Jess went to school together. In terms of being a surrogate, Jess says, didn’t feel like an obligation. It felt like a calling, like I was made to do this. I wonder if any potential surrogates listening feel the same. This was an easy episode to edit as Jess spoke so clearly and with such enthusiasm. She tells one funny story about one of the first nights after second surrogate, Logan was born.

01:40
and I’ve used that as the title for this episode. I slept like a surrogate whose job was done. I hope you enjoy hearing that story when you get to it and the rest of her insights. It shows that although each surrogacy journey is similar in terms of the steps we all go through, they’re all different as we as surrogates and women are all different too. As well as the IPs, every team is different. I hope you enjoy this episode.

02:05
You’ve done two journeys, Jess. Yeah. Yeah. And you talk about having felt called to be a surrogate. So I guess take us back to the beginning there about. Yeah. Yeah. So I have my two girls. They’re currently 19 and 17. So I, I delivered Logan in September last year and her sister Firth just turned four earlier this year. So they’re quite young and my kids are quite old, but that conversation.

02:31
comes up with women or with mothers all the time about, you think you have more kids? And I’ve, I had always said, no, no, no, we’re happy. We’ve got our two girls. We’ve got a family history of every woman in my mother’s side of the family having two girls. So I’m one of two girls. She’s one of two girls. Her mom’s one of two girls. Her mom was one of two girls. So after we had our two girls, my husband and I thought beautiful. That’s what we wanted. So we were ready to, you know, to move on from having babies. But every time that

03:01
conversation came up, I would always just flippantly offhand say, oh no, we’re our family’s complete, but you know, I could be a surrogate. I was really good at being pregnant and you know, I’d show off that I had really easy, great pregnancies and my labors were, you know, fuss free. So I would say that without really considering what it meant. And it was when I said that to Rhiannon, who was our egg donor, that she caught that and she said, oh, you need to talk to my brother.

03:30
Oh my gosh, you need to talk to Ryan. And so I kind of thought, Oh, hang on. I’ve just been saying this, you know, really meaningful thing without meaning it. Well, okay. So I got in touch with.

03:42
Ryan and they had three embryos. Yeah. They had, me, three embryos and the conversation kind of started about that. They were looking for a surrogate and was I serious about this? And so I kind of went away and I thought, Ooh, I don’t know. Could I actually do this? Could I really do it? Could I have a baby and carry a baby? I think at the time my kids were maybe 12 and 14.

04:08
well and truly passed the point of, you know, anything related to kids. They were both in high school. They’ll both, you know, you’d probably consider them like young women, very far removed from, you know, babies. So that thought of, oh, could I be pregnant again? Oh, I don’t know.

04:25
but the more I thought about it, I was sort of left with this big question of could I really go through with this thing that I’ve been saying? And the more I thought about it, it felt like, yeah, so I’ve kind of used that term that it wasn’t, I didn’t feel obliged to do it. I didn’t feel like I should do it. I felt like I was put in this position. I have the ability to do this. So if I have,

04:49
the ability to carry a baby. If I have a previous history of having a pretty simple pregnancy, a fuss free labor, if I can do this and I choose not to, what a cruel thing to do, what a selfish thing to do. I’ve sort of referred to it as if I see someone tripping over on the street, I’m not gonna just step over them, I’m gonna stop and help them because I can. But helping somebody who’s tripped over in a street, somebody would say is…

05:16
Again a very lovely kind gesture. It’s a much further huge leap in commitment to be pregnant and birth for another person And so some people don’t make that connection but often surrogates do and go yeah, I think I could do this Yeah, well, I think at least

05:31
For the people who have, I’ve told that I was a surrogate too and you kind of touched on it that some people sort of wrinkle their nose, go, oh, I couldn’t do that. Oh, no, no, no, I couldn’t do that. But I think for a surrogate, the consideration of the pain of the labor and the risk of a…

05:49
you know, complicated pregnancy and the swollen ankles and the stretch marks, they don’t, that’s not a consideration. You’re not thinking, but what if all of these hard, terrible things happen? You’re thinking, yeah, but I can just, they could have a baby. This will happen, but then they’ll have a baby. yeah, so to simplify it in that, you know, tripping, someone tripping over and me picking them up.

06:13
the consideration of the toll that it would take on my body just didn’t exist. There was no consideration of, you know, I obviously wanted to make sure that I was healthy, but yeah, that didn’t really come into it for me. Did your uh partner, husband and girls, were they in support or they had some reservations at the beginning? Yeah. So once I’d kind of had this confirmation within myself that,

06:35
You know what? think we can move to the next step of my flippin, oh, I could just be a surrogate. I thought about what, comes next. So I spoke to my husband and I spoke to my girls and I said from the very beginning, if, if any one of you don’t want me to do this, I’m not doing it. I don’t care how much I want to do it. If you don’t want me to do it, I’m not doing it. And I would, I wouldn’t even really say that I was lucky that they were all so supportive. We’re a close family. So, you know, anything that any of, any of us wanted to do, I think we would all be in support.

07:05
of. My husband, was wonderfully supportive. you know, being parents has been the best thing that’s ever happened to us. So for him to be able to be part of that was, yeah, it was no different, not a difficult decision for him. And yeah, for our girls, they were excited about the idea that they would have a baby to play with by the end of this. And really, like a pregnancy isn’t all that

07:30
you know, effective to them. I’m the one that’s, you know, toiling and I’m the one that’s this and that and you know, they’re teenage girls, nothing affects them. So they were all in support and yeah, so it made the decision to kind of formally make that statement. Yes, I can do this. It made that yeah, a very easy decision.

07:50
to make. I went back to Ryan and Adam and said, yes, I can do this. Let’s see what happens. Let’s do, let’s do the next step. So I went to my GP, I got my referral for the IVF clinic. We started that process with the counseling, with the lawyers, the agreements, the sorrow dating, the getting to know each other. I did know them. They were Ryan and Adam.

08:14
were always in my, you know, my bigger friend group. Rhiannon and I were close from high school. So it was only that Ryan was my friend’s brother. And you know, you sort of have that peripheral friend group. So yeah, we got to know each other a little bit more. They were at the time living in Queensland though. So yeah, we got to see them every time that they came down to visit at, know, Christmas and holidays. And we kept in touch online and over the phone. The process, it’s long, cause you’ve got to make an appointment, you know, with, yeah, the obstetrician.

08:44
you can’t get in for seven weeks and then you go to that appointment and they just give you a referral for an x-ray or an ultrasound and then you’ve got to take that and make an appointment. So everything is very, it takes a long, long time. So it gave us a really good opportunity to get to know each other and to just, know, Brian and I would sit on the phone for hours just talking about anything, everything, movies.

09:05
our childhoods, what we were doing at work, know, everything. So, um yeah, we ended up probably having, you know, FaceTime only about three or four times maybe before Firth was born. And then about, I think, six weeks after Firth was born, they moved to Sydney. I’ve got some questions there. So hang on, three or four FaceTimes, but…

09:27
What about attending appointments with you and things like that? Did you do that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I did that all by myself. Yeah. Yeah. Well, my mum would come when she called and I invited Rhiannon and Ryan and Rhiannon’s mum to ultrasounds and appointments. But yeah, a lot of it was done. Yes. With me just, you know, went and saw this doctor and that doctor. You’re almost a bit more like an overseas surgeon, if you don’t mind me saying it’s because often in Australia, teams are much more hands on. Well, can be, but don’t have to be. And you’re a great example in terms

09:57
of the types of support then that they either might have provided for you during pregnancy. So some teams might they might come and help clean or cook or take your kids out for some time or pay for some types of supports. Was there types of supports during pregnancy that you needed that they were able to help with or? Yeah, yeah.

10:13
They, well, like I’d said, my, kids were quite older, so they were quite self-sufficient. Yeah. I didn’t need a lot of help. I’m mumming them while I was pregnant. I got a delivery of frozen food, just turned up like frozen meals. And so I was like, I don’t have to cook. This is so good. They offered and offered and offered to have a cleaner come in and, know, do the bathroom and all of that stuff. But my husband and my girls were really helpful with that. Or, you know, I would just say, Oh, that’s fine. I’ll pick that up. I’ve dropped that on the floor. I will pick it up.

10:43
in four months when I can bend over again.

10:46
Were your pregnancies therefore with the two surrogate girls, were you particularly sick and needed much time off work? No, not really. Well, I had gestational diabetes with both. So every now and then I needed to go to the hospital to have checkups with the midwives and with the diabetes doctor. So if I needed to take time off for that, they would cover that, lost my wage. In the second pregnancy then, since that they had moved closer only say 40.

11:14
Was it any different in them attending more appointments or this was just the dynamic that seemed to work for your team? Oh no definitely with Logan the second baby yeah Ryan was yeah able when he could to come to appointments so yeah he would come to ultrasounds even just to blood tests that took 10 minutes he would still come now that he called he was very involved. Wonderful well maybe that’s a good moment to go to some of the photos and

11:39
We’ll talk about those and then they might bring some memories. So out of privacy to the parents and their daughters, we haven’t got any photos of them, but this is here to talk about your journey and to show your side of it. So we’ve got very pregnant Belly here with the first surrogate bub there with Firth. Yes. Anything that you want to say as you look at yourself in these mirror selfies? I definitely feel like I look better than I felt. Yeah.

12:06
that was a big belly so I felt like I was dragging myself around but I think in those photos I probably look better than I felt which is good. Yeah you forget how big bellies get. Yeah yeah I’ve got some photos of my husband having to do my shoelaces up I would just walk over with a pair of shoes and then just hand them to him and he would have to do that yeah. I’ve got a photo of my son helping me my duos four so probably couldn’t do shoelaces but maybe with the velcro or something like that so it’s those things that get hard don’t they.

12:36
Do remember how many weeks along you were when you birthed and were you induced or it came on naturally? Yeah, with birth, Adam, one of her dads actually was not present for the birth because they were living in Queensland. Ryan had planned to come down and work from home from uh maybe three, I think it was about three weeks before the due date. So he arrived on a Sunday and Adam was to come the following weekend. So a week later, I went into spontaneous labor on Monday, Monday morning.

13:05
So you could still consider that Sunday night, but it was at about four o’clock in the morning on, um, Monday morning that my water broke while I was asleep and birth was born maybe an hour and a half after my water broke. So not, not enough time for Adam to get there and barely enough time for Ryan to get from where he was staying. Yeah. It all happened very quickly. Um, so as far as the timeline of these, I could not.

13:31
even begin to guess. Yeah, probably pretty quite a long. You can see the difference between the photos that yeah, she’s sitting quite low in the second. But I think, you know, probably pretty close to the end. Yes. And then I don’t think we’ve got the photo of that one. But I think the next photo is we moving on to the embryo transfer of number two. Let’s just go through the photos and then we’ll come back to the fact that you offered to go again. Did it work first embryo transfer with both girls? No, first was our third and last embryo.

14:01
So

14:02
We had all our hopes on that. And so yeah, thankfully that took, and it was a really beautiful moment with Firth. The nurses of the testing center, whoever called Ryan to let him know that the pregnancy blood test that I had done was positive. And he called me to tell me that I was pregnant. So he knew I was pregnant before I did, which I think is really special. Yeah, I’m really glad it worked out like that. That’s interesting. Cause do you know that’s technically not the right way around? Yeah, they had tried to call me and I missed the call.

14:32
then they called him. Yeah. Yes. Cause I, so for people that are brand new listening, it’s because it’s in your body, it’s your medical news. they’re technically legally supposed to tell anybody else your news, but sorry, there might be different things in place. So how funny is that being told by other people that you’re pregnant, right?

14:50
So some photos of the second one, Logan’s pregnancy. Was there some extra monitoring that happened during this pregnancy? Yes, so these, two with the monitors are just that, think that’s called the TENS machine maybe that measures the contractions. Yes, so that’s during active labor. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Was this a fairly swift labor as well, this second one? Logan’s was…

15:12
very, very different. Yeah, yeah. I had to be induced because they didn’t want me to go to 40 weeks. So that was the plan with Firth, but I went into spontaneous labor. So we skipped that induction process, but I was induced with Logan and it was just taking a very, very long time. I got to the hospital on a Sunday and she was born on Wednesday. So yeah, quite a lot of waiting around. Not a lot of, I was in a little bit of pain,

15:42
during the induction process. I didn’t need to be medicated. was, I was able to just manage it, you know, with breathing and swear words. And then when my water broke and I was in active labor, Logan was born again, about an hour and a half after active labor started. Yeah. So the, as far as monitoring when it was just pretty standard, the TENS machine measuring the contraction rate and then the heart rate of the baby as well. I know. Yep. And so then, yes, some of the photos here, well, I’ve

16:11
put them in the wrong order then because I thought those photos were some monitoring but that was some birth photos but we’ve got some photos here. Well one is of uh some monitoring during birth and another one is those listening on the podcast. Is you eating possibly ice cream or breakfast off your big belly in a bowl? Yes yeah using yeah using the baby as a plate or as a a table rather yeah yeah enjoying some ice cream.

16:33
Um, yeah, with my little built-in table. The other one I’m experiencing a contraction, the tape with the monitor on it kept slipping. So they had to keep putting it, um, putting it back on. think ultimately they placed a monitor on the head of the baby inside like the womb or the cervix, whatever it is. So up internally because it kept sliding down and they kept getting annoyed because as it would slip and there was no monitor, oh the machine will go crazy because it couldn’t register a heartbeat or.

17:03
whatever it was trying to get, they said, you know what, let’s just go inside. We were talking before, we’re both people who have had our placentas encapsulated and that’s what you’re in picture of here. And so that was something that you did with both the girls? Yeah, not with my girls, but with Firth and Logan. Yeah, I kept the placenta and I’m still working my way through the tablets. Yeah, that’s wonderful. And then a little photo with her name, well, no, with everybody’s name in terms of the dads and you. So with the hospital and the midwives and obstetricians,

17:32
fairly supportive of your surrogacy team? Yeah, so this card was from Firth and you can see that it’s got my name at the end. With Logan, there was no mention of my name on the card at all, which was wonderful. That was because it wasn’t my baby. Okay. Yes. It was really great. We birthed at the same hospital both times, the local public hospital, Campbelltown Hospital for the people who I’ve noticed are in that area. We were both the first and the third surrogacy ever at that hospital. They previously had

18:02
a surrogacy birth in the November and then we had Logan in the following September. They were very excited to get everything right and gave and just sort of said tell us what you want and we will make it happen. With Firth there was a just a like a fold out chair in the single room that I had that Ryan could sleep on. Firth was stayed stayed in the NICU for about a week I think. I was discharged a day I think 20 maybe it was a full 24 hours after the

18:32
I discharged and went home and yeah, and Firth stayed a little bit longer. With Logan, ah it was incredible. We got a double room, whichever dad was staying.

18:42
I think it was Adam. Adam stayed the night. He had his own hospital bed. I had my own bed. So he was getting meals delivered. He had Logan with him. I remember one moment when the midwife was coming or the nurses were coming through to do handover and you you might know they sort of speak to each other and they’ll, you know, they say, you know, she’s, had a blood test at this time and we’ve got the results and baby’s gone and had the hearing tests and they sort of just talked to each other. And the nurse said something like, um, and

19:12
Mum’s had a shower, she’s had her, you know, she’s had a bowel movement and then she went, oh, I’m so sorry. Jess, Jess has just had a shower, she’s expressing me or whatever. But yeah, she stopped herself and changed what she’d said, because I wasn’t mum, I was Jess. But I guess that that’s something that they just get in the habit of saying is just calling mum to…

19:33
know, the mothers. yes, that was really nice that she caught herself and stopped and said, nope, sorry, not mum, Jess. That was really nice. Yeah. So the hospital was, was wonderful.

19:43
really very accommodating. That’s great. Yeah. And yes, often if you’re some of the first surrogacy birth those hospitals have had, you’re helping to educate them along the way. I think as you say, most people are happy to learn and want to learn, but they still have to be beginners, don’t they? That’s just part of it, I guess. Some last photos to finish off. So did you express milk with both girls? Yeah. Yeah. I had the old school pump that you had to hold in place with Firth. So when I went back to work, I think six weeks after her birth,

20:13
I was really trying to maintain my supply and pump at work, but working in, I had my own private office, so I’d close the door and I’d continue to try and work with one hand while holding the pump in place. And people would be knocking on the door and I would have to, it would be like a full hour that I would be trying to pump and it just became too difficult. So after about maybe nine weeks, so yeah, I tried for a few weeks and yeah, I let.

20:42
the supply dry up and instantly, the day after the milk dried up, was so much frustration. I thought I should have just persisted. really want, I should have kept that milk. I, yeah, I’ve told myself with Logan that I will continue expressing my, just my flat out is that I will continue expressing milk forever. I’m not going to put a, you know, uh a timeline on it to review. So Logan turned nine months at the start of this month.

21:12
expressing milk three times a day and do not intend to stop. Wow, what a woman. I was gonna say like, because I express for nine weeks, still be proud of nine weeks first time around. Oh yeah. Here you are, nine months. Well done. You should be so proud of that and I bet the dad is so thankful for it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so the difference is that I’ve got a great pump now. It’s wearable so I can just pop it into my bra so I can type with both hands. I’ve pumped at

21:37
concerts at festivals, on international flights. I’ve pumped in Vegas, I’ve pumped in Fiji, I’ve pumped in Bali, I’ve pumped, you know, in the car, doing the groceries, you name it, I’ve done it, yep. Fantastic, what an inspiration. Now, yes, so for people listening there, I mean, this is one example, everybody can be different, but this is a fantastic.

21:59
Well, that’s excellent. OK, Chloe has said in the chat there, can she just say how amazing it is to hear actual surrogate birth stories from the hospital that she would birth as a surrogate? So thank you for sharing that. really makes it.

22:11
Real isn’t it when you go wow that’s where I will be. I think I might work through some of these questions really quickly because I could do some quick answers but you feel free to interject Jess if you’ve got any. People have typed them into Q &A but most of them are anonymous. So I’m going to go quickly through these. How long do you recommend IPs and babies stay close to the surrogate after birth and how often to see visit? The psychologists recommend that you’re a doorway apart for the first week which means either in a hospital having rooms next door to each other or if you’re

22:41
living near each other or an Airbnb, very close, seeing each other multiple times a day for the first week, in the second week, then going to every second day and then pacing it out. So if the IPs are long distance where interstate, we would recommend that they’re there for two weeks post-birth and preferably a bit before as well. So I hope that answers that one. How many embryos do they transfer at a time? Is there a limit or is it up to preference? In Australia, we only do one embryo at a time. That’s mainly in IVF.

23:06
general population but definitely in surrogacy we don’t do twins here in Australia. What are placenta capsules? It’s the placenta is the afterbirth that gets birthed and so you can get that um dried with the umbilical cord and then dried and turned into capsules. uh essentially you’re eating your placenta if you like. We’re the only mammals that don’t usually do it.

23:26
And so those capsules in theory are full of the nutrients and the iron that was in the placenta. So that’s why some of us do it. Because Danielle types in, regular is it for a surrogate to get the placenta made into capsules? And do you know if it has a notable impact on recovery? Did you want to add anything there, Jess, about what your knowledge of placenta capsulations are? Yeah, just the amount of nutrients from it was the draw card for me. I’ve got to say, though, I was a little hesitant. And I did say if…

23:54
You know, you’ll have a fish oil tablet and then you’ll get it like a fishy burp. And so I thought if I get like a meaty burp, I’m not doing it. I’ll have one to test it. But if it’s, I, if it tastes weird, I’m not going to keep going. There’s no taste. It’s, fine. Yeah. Just like taking a Panadol. You can’t taste anything. Yeah. Sorry. I’ll be, yeah. I think the benefits have just been increased. My recovery perhaps has helped with milk. I’m not sure how many scientific studies there are, but I feel it’s definitely been helpful to me.

24:24
Yeah, that’s my understanding is that it potentially helps with milk supply there. Anonymous typing in, might not get through all of these, does follow up with why is it important for the surrogate and IP to stay close once baby’s born? It’s also about what might be in the best interest of the child born. So the…

24:39
person in the body that that child is most used to is the surrogate, her smells and her noises and her children’s noises too and so it’s about in some ways weaning that child off the surrogate and weaning it onto the bond with the new parents. Again that’s not necessarily for everybody but the surrogate’s bodies, the psychologists talk about head heart hormones that as surrogates our head and our heart know where baby is loved and cared for in the arms of the parents we do not want to raise this baby. We are happy, they are happy but our hormones they have birthed a baby and

25:09
They are searching for that baby going where is the baby even though I hit in our heart. I like no no no It’s fine. I don’t want the baby But that’s so sometimes having cuddles for the surrogate to have baby cuddles actually helps to bring a sense of peace to her body And it just goes ah it settles her hormones So being able to do that multiple times a day in the first week and then easing off that can just help the surrogate’s body

25:31
to adjust to the hormone fluctuations. Is there anything that you would like to add there Jess, as you think back to those times post-birth and having cuddles? Firth and Logan were always, to me they’re considered my friends’ kids. So I gave them a cuddle as much as I would love to give any other of my friends’ babies a cuddle. I didn’t feel any need for that, you know, that handover or that break in emotional connection. They are my friends’ kids.

25:59
So I enjoy, I would love a cuddle with anyone’s baby. The fact that it was the baby that I had carried didn’t come into that for me. Yeah.

26:07
And how much do you guys manage to see each other these days? And does that feel about right? Did you want more or less? No, no, no, no. They, I see, I see Logan and Firth as often as I see any of my other friends’ kids. So, you know, if there’s a long weekend and everyone decides to catch up, I’ll see them then. um We were invited to Firth’s fourth birthday party. So we went and spent some time with her there. Barely saw her. She was off running and playing in the park, but I got some nice cuddles from Logan who hated me, screamed and cried.

26:37
when I tried to pick her up, which was fine, because she doesn’t know me and that’s okay. I definitely know that if I asked Ryan and Adam to allow me to have more time or that I wanted to see Logan or Firth more than I do, they would happily give me that, but I’ve got a busy life. don’t have time to be sitting and playing with babies. That’s their job. My kids are growing up, so I’ve moved on from that. Yes. Well, it sounds like you’re in a really great place and that this calling that you felt…

27:05
to do worked out and that you got to this point and once you’d had the baby you’re like yeah I could do it and I did it and I’m not feeling like this oh no I want the baby back or anything like that. I actually I’ll quickly share a story the night after Logan’s birth like I said we had me in one bed and Adam in another bed and it got to about bedtime and so you know I filled up our water bottles I went to the toilet one last time I got changed my pajamas I kind of came over and said is there anything I can get you you know I’m about to go to

27:35
And he said no, I’m all good. He had no his little setup. He’s got Logan in there. He’s got some fresh nappies I said, okay, well, I’m gonna go to bed. So I got into bed. I bought my earplugs in I bought my eye mask on I got into bed. I did not move nothing I woke up in the morning and I looked over at Adam and he’s rocking Logan He said she hasn’t slept. I haven’t slept every time I put it as she cries and I was like, oh Sorry

28:04
So I like to say that in that moment, I had a great, I had a full night’s sleep. I barely rolled over. normally people would say when they slept well that they slept like a baby. But for me, that first night, I slept like a surrogate whose job was done. Your baby’s crying. That’s you. That’s not me. I dealt with, yep, you’re good. You now have all of that. The reflux getting vomited on. You’ve got the dirty napkins. I’m all good. I’ll grab a cuddle when I want.

28:33
But yeah, I’m cool. So I had expressed colostrum and, you know, obviously continued to express milk, but my mum brought me a full pack of margaritas to the hospital and I took a video where I wrapped the margaritas up in one of the little hospital blankets. Had my husband video me. So I’m sitting in the bed rocking these cans of margaritas in this blanket and you can’t see the face. So he came over and then I peeled back the blanket and it was this full pack of margarita cans.

29:02
I mean, this is fantastic for people who might have never met a surrogate before and they’re meeting two of us. Just to hear these stories and to hear how real this can be. It’s like, oh wow, I’d never thought about it like that. But I think you’ve already created a title episode here. You know, I slept like a surrogate who’s done her job well. I did what I wanted to do. So yeah, well done. You’ve earned that sleep back and no big belly to get in the way of rolling over either. Yeah. The first thing I did when I got home was sleep on my stomach. That was so good. And tie my

29:32
shoelaces up. Oh, it’s so good. That’s fantastic. Well, we’ll start to pull it to a close, but there’s still so many things we could have talked about. What are the other things that we haven’t covered that spring to mind that were either challenging or that your team did well or advice you want to give to people? Yeah, I guess how an IP navigates the amount of support that

29:52
their surrogate needs or wants. So we sort of touched on, you know, cleaners and filling up the fridge and, you know, trying to take some of that pressure off being pregnant and all of the things that sort of helps prevent you doing. But

30:05
the line I think between the help that you need and the help that they’re ready to give you needs to kind of be agreed on. So like I said, I was quite independent. I was happy to go to appointments by myself. I didn’t need help with any housework. I was very happy to have received those frozen meals, but I didn’t ask for them. Anything that I did want, I was confident to ask for and I knew that I would get. But I suppose something for people to consider is that you’re…

30:30
your love language maybe might be different. So yeah, someone might need more support than you were prepared to give and vice versa. So yeah, I think that’s something to keep in the back of your mind about how to navigate those things because you might be in a relationship and so you’ve got that really almost telekinetic connection to someone. But with this person who’s almost in the same relationship, they’re very close to you. They may need…

30:57
they may prefer their needs met quite differently. Yeah. So something to consider. 100%. In SASS we actually get the IPs and the surrogates to all do the love languages tests. So, cause it creates a great conversation. Yeah. We did the same during our counselling. Great. And also it’s a real reminder that yes, there’s a whole process to go through with surrogacy, but it’s all sometimes it’s four adults coming together to create a baby and adults are complex human beings. And there’s relationships that are all going on here that are intertwined.

31:27
Usually when you make a baby, it’s just between the surrogate and her partner. Now, so suddenly you’re involving many more people. And so yes, there’s a relationship element, huge part of that, of this whole surrogacy journey isn’t there. So were there any particular things, any big major bumps with the relationships that felt challenging at times? And if so, how did you work through it? Oh, well the distance with, excuse me, with Firth, with Adam and Ryan being in Queensland, I felt like, you know, I was seeing ultrasound photos

31:57
during the moment they were seeing them on the recording. this is their, I shouldn’t be saying this, this is their baby. trying to, yeah, trying to not overshare things so that they could see them for the first time.

32:10
were here for the first time things trying to give them a good experience, a good sort of pregnancy experience. So I would tell them, you know, I’m constipated or, I’m getting like a hemorrhoid or I’m getting birth, food craving. So every time I craved for something, Ryan would have the same thing. Yeah. And I, with Firth, I would, I would have.

32:30
I would kill someone to get through them to get a Maccas coat. Oh, it’s all I thought. It was all I thought about. I started a new job while I was pregnant and I think there was one day my car was at the mechanic. I went over to one of my co-workers with this fire in my eyes. I said, give me car keys. I’m going to McDonald’s and they just handed them over. Okay, go, go, go. So when birth was born, I just, you know, naturally went through to go to Maccas drive-through, got myself my Coke, a sip. Oh, this is horrible. It’s too sweet.

33:00
Yes. Yeah, so I, oh, and even now, like, I wouldn’t get one if I, if I was to get a drink at McDonald’s, I’d get like a zero or yeah, something else. But I could not, I did not stop thinking about Macca’s Cokes with Firth. Yeah. So yeah, I was lucky that Ryan was, he would grab one too, and they would, how much money you need, here’s all the money, buy as many as you want. It’s your baby that wants this, not me. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that’s wonderful. Well, I mean, again, I feel like I could talk to you

33:30
hours and just ask all of the details. I feel like we’ve covered a fair bit. Any last minute parting advice to those who are brand new? I’m really happy to have had the opportunity to come and talk to people and I hope my waffling on has, you know, maybe been a little bit helpful to people.

33:45
Everyone’s story, I think, is both very similar and quite different. We all go through those same processes with all of the testing and the lawyers and the psychology. You end up with the same result. You have a baby for your IPs. They have their family. But I think, you know, often the journey can be quite different. So it’s interesting when I get the opportunity to hear stories of other people’s journeys. I hope that other people have been able to get, you know, a good perspective from me and my journey. spot on. uh

34:15
I reckon they have. can see in the chat that people are saying, thank you, Jess, you’re amazing. Creating life is very rewarding and thank you for sharing your story. So I hope, hope you can feel the love on the chat line tonight. Thank you. For those on the podcast, she did a heart with her hands. I did the old school one, the millennial one. I think the kids, I don’t even know how they’re doing it now. Some other way. Yeah. The youngs, I don’t know. Do you therefore roughly remember how old you were at each of the births then Jess? I think 36 and I

34:45
would have been 39 with Logan. I turned 40 this year. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Bang on average then by my data gathering. Thank you for sharing your time with me for this episode. If you’re finding these episodes helpful, please share them with friends. If you’d like to see the images mentioned, head to our YouTube channel for all of the recordings. If you’re looking for more individualized support, consider joining SAS, Surrogacy Australia’s support service, so you can be connected with a mentor and also with me to help guide you on a journey.

35:15
might think of me as your Siri for surrogacy. Until next time, welcome to the village.